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Submitted on
November 9, 2012
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Sextoy01 by kozispoon

Sextoy02 by kozispoon

Sextoy03 by kozispoon
Sextoy04 by kozispoon


Alright, alright, settle down. While this isn't crazy serious, it's still an update worth note!

Throughout history, art and artists have challenged preconceived notions, pushed boundaries and taken on subjects often considered taboo. Art is alive and constantly changing, much like the community at deviantART is. The CEA Team believes that deviantART policy must grow, adapt and change, to allow artists to push boundaries and express themselves whenever legally and morally possible. Policy must remain flexible in order for something, which was initially ruled as an absolute, to bend and change in order to allow for artists and quality to shine through.

Lesbians 101 - Lesson 3 by FindChaos

One example of this kind of challenge to policy is with FindChaos's Lesbians 101 series-- a quirky and often humorous guide on lesbianism. Unfortunately, one installment of this guide depicted sex toys, which was removed in accordance with our FAQs prohibiting pornographic imagery. This issue prompted a discussion among staff and our legal adviser regarding our policies and FAQs. Are items like sex toys to be considered inherently and inescapably pornographic, or, as in the case of Lesbians 101, could members express themselves artistically and responsibly despite the content?

The CEA team held a series of meetings about the FAQ that details the prohibitions made in regards to the depiction of sex toys, and after some careful discussion (and using lesbians 101 as an example) we came to the decision that deviations such as these should have a place within the deviantART community. Naturally, we needed to update our FAQ to reflect this. We have spent the week working on the language of the FAQ, and the changes are live!  Here's a link for you to see:

FAQ #565: You prohibit the submission of 'pornographic imagery'; what do you consider this to be?

So what has changed? And what does this realistic depiction mean?

What has changed is that sex toys can now be depicted in deviations (given certain conditions). As for "Realistic", this refers primarily to shape, so a realistic shape and unrealistic candy coloring would still lead to removal. By contrast, a review of the sex toys in Lesbians 101 would not fall under realistic depiction as they have spines, beads, and rabbits protruding from them. We still maintain that sex toys cannot be depicted in use as per the FAQ.

Please also note that context comes into play here. Realistic depictions of sex toys are normally removed, but the educational context of the work such as those used in Lesbians 101 and the clinical treatment of the subject means that this submission is fine with a mature tag- that will not necessarily be the case for other deviations. Because each submission is judged based upon the content, context, and merit of that specific deviation. If there are any doubts on the part of the artist for any reason, they are always free to submit their questions to the +help Desk, through Policy Inquiries, and we'll be more than happy to help!

We understand that a change to such a specific part of this FAQ may be surprising--there may even be be a lot of attention drawn to this deviation, and it will definitely be a mix of negative and positive--but we really believe that this approach will garner the greatest understanding from the community.
Sextoy05 by kozispoon
Thank you to ~FindChaos for her patience and for allowing us to feature her deviation for the sake of this discussion. Be sure to check it out!

It's incredibly exciting when a piece of artwork sparks a discussion amongst our team, and we hope to continually grow and change while still maintaining a safe, artistic environment!            
An update to our FAQs!
Add a Comment:
 
:iconkozispoon:
kozispoon Featured By Owner May 20, 2013  Student General Artist
May be indeed!
Reply
:iconshibuya4lone:
Shibuya4lone Featured By Owner May 20, 2013
i see
Reply
:iconfehnryr:
Fehnryr Featured By Owner May 9, 2013
...So if I draw a dildo it's fine, but if I draw a neon green dildo, it gets removed?

You guys might want to go back to the drawing board...
Reply
:iconpeccantis:
Peccantis Featured By Owner May 12, 2013   General Artist
No no, a realistic shaped dildo (closely imitating actual anatomical parts of the specific actual anatomy part) is not ok regardless of its colour. Is how I understood the rulings here.
Reply
:iconkozispoon:
kozispoon Featured By Owner May 20, 2013  Student General Artist
Correct. Come, frolic with me in the fields of clarity and understanding. :icononiskiplz:
Reply
:iconpeccantis:
Peccantis Featured By Owner May 20, 2013   General Artist
:iconoppaplz:
Reply
:iconfancycomicsreborn:
FancyComicsReborn Featured By Owner Apr 11, 2013  Student Photographer
You may be a staff and all, but you should really take the time to look through that ACTUALLY don't belong here. Hey, just like iFunny, this ain't a porno site. Some stuff I (accidentally) find makes me go into WTF made.

I will not start pointing fingers. That just ain't cool.
Reply
:iconkozispoon:
kozispoon Featured By Owner May 20, 2013  Student General Artist
Reply
:iconbungy32:
Bungy32 Featured By Owner Mar 10, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
I am new to DA and learning the ropes. I just went back through my gallery and deleted deviations that don't conform with these rules. I grumbled a bit. Gone is a cartoon robot holding his hard phallus. It's hard because he's made of metal -- but "touching genitals" and "erect" make it a violation. The fact that it is smooth and shaped more like a missile than an anatomically correct penis might have made a difference, but who can say? I also removed a cartoon of two robots having butt sex, using motor oil as (what else?) lubrication. It seemed to violate the penetration and fluids rule. It wasn't just porn; I like the way this series raises interesting conundrums about the posthuman condition. But you know, we play by the rules of our hosts...

The good news in this post is that the moderators have moderated their policy in the wake of broadening their understanding of how their policy disproportionately affects a minority group. I deeply appreciate that our hosts are addressable on these issues and willing to adjust.

But I have to admit: as a queer artist interested in art that is not only aesthetically pleasing but also witty and a little disturbing, I draw heavily from an explicitly homoerotic palette. And rules are often just challenges in disguise. Can I contribute work that conforms to the rules but defies their spirit? You betcha! Will I? Oh yeah, quite probably.

Because at the end of the day, that's what artists do -- push at boundaries, challenge the rules. Those boundaries aren't always about sex -- sometimes they are about skill level or politics or taboos or... But if we deny art's ability to change our views about what is allowable and what is not in our myriad, overlapping cultures, then we curtail much of the value and purpose of art in the first place.
Reply
:iconsempersalsius:
SemperSalsius Featured By Owner Mar 24, 2013  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
Very well said.
Reply
:iconbungy32:
Bungy32 Featured By Owner Mar 24, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
Thx. I've "moved on," so to speak. I still chafe a bit at what I can't post here. But, you know, there's ointment for that. ;-)
Reply
:iconsempersalsius:
SemperSalsius Featured By Owner Mar 25, 2013  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
Haha! :D
Reply
:iconnevegraceirvine2004:
NeveGraceIrvine2004 Featured By Owner Mar 6, 2013  Professional Digital Artist
Look at this account and help this person affected by a person who used these toys :icontwisterthetornado: <<< CLICK/TAP
Reply
:iconscorpiogreen:
ScorpioGreen Featured By Owner Mar 4, 2013  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
The phallus has been featured in art for ages....Pompeii , Greece , & now moden art. If something happens to this earth and we are all gone, they will find our brightly colored ribbed for our pleasure rubber toys stuck in our bedside table. I think DA did a great job in finding a happy medium. All this talk of phallus... im grabbing my sketch book!
Reply
:iconkozispoon:
kozispoon Featured By Owner Mar 4, 2013  Student General Artist
:icongeorgetakaiplz:
Reply
:iconalthazaire:
Althazaire Featured By Owner Mar 3, 2013
If you ban sex toy imagery, then you must ban genitalia imagery of any kind - fucking derr. neither is inherently sexual until depicted in sexual use. You guys must be stupid because there seems to be little rational debate to be had about this.
Reply
:iconkozispoon:
kozispoon Featured By Owner Mar 3, 2013  Student General Artist
We aren't banning sex toy imagery. Give the article another read :)
Reply
:iconmewmew34:
Mewmew34 Featured By Owner Mar 2, 2013  Hobbyist Photographer
I find it funny that the comic was originally removed for "pornography" yet more than once I've seen images receive a Daily Deviation that are little else but pornography. We can't age up an animated character for tasteful adult situations, but women are allowed to flash real life vagina all they want.
Reply
:iconkozispoon:
kozispoon Featured By Owner Mar 11, 2013  Student General Artist
Pornography is never submitted by staff as a DD, but please note the mere depiction of genitals does not immediately conform to the definition of pornography that we have in place. If you have differing views on what you consider pornography that's all well and good, but if that's the case then this is a whole different conversation.
Reply
:iconmrspeedypanda:
MrSpeedyPanda Featured By Owner Feb 21, 2013
Lol god that little comic strip at the top made me lol so hard.
Reply
:iconcactussinn:
cactussinn Featured By Owner Feb 20, 2013
I'm less disturbed by a drawing of sex-toys than by aweful 3D-renders of women being torn apart by medieval devices in a sexual purpose but eh, deviantArt.
Reply
:iconnuclearjackal:
NuclearJackal Featured By Owner Feb 20, 2013  Professional Digital Artist
Gotta love the illustrations
Reply
:iconwickedjuti:
WickedJuti Featured By Owner Feb 15, 2013  Professional General Artist
"By contrast, a review of the sex toys in Lesbians 101 would not fall under realistic depiction as they have spines, beads, and rabbits protruding from them." ... But there are sex toys like that :o Vibrators with bunnies are very popular these days. xD
Anyways, I do think if the toy is not being used then it fine. Otherwise, if it's "in action", then it's a no no.
Reply
:iconkozispoon:
kozispoon Featured By Owner Feb 15, 2013  Student General Artist
The article didn't meant to imply that those sex toys don't exist because they do. It'd be pretty silly to say they don't exist when the very deviation that sparked this article has them :lol:

What the article is trying to say a vibrator with a bunny on it would be fine for depiction since it doesn't resemble a real and receptive sexual organ.
Reply
:iconstinkehund:
Stinkehund Featured By Owner May 20, 2013  Hobbyist Digital Artist
So by that logic, vibrating eggs, "cheap" vibrators (y'know, the smooth stereotypical ones) and everything else along those lines would be fine? Because they sure as hell don't resemble any real sexual organ i've ever seen.
Reply
:iconkozispoon:
kozispoon Featured By Owner May 20, 2013  Student General Artist
That would be true, but as always, the context of said depictions will always matter. A photograph of a vibrating egg lying by the roadside would be more than acceptable, wheras a vibrating egg shoved up respective orifices, would not.
Lovin' your corgi icon!
Reply
:iconstinkehund:
Stinkehund Featured By Owner May 20, 2013  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Fair enough, i guess. Although if that rule would be truly enforced, pretty much half of what i've personally seen on dA over those last few years would've been deleted by now.. not to mention all those clearly-artistic flaccid-penis pictures.

So where would that one fall into?
[link] - i censored it for humorous effect, but she really only has a rectangle with wiggly lines in hoof underneath it.
Reply
:iconkozispoon:
kozispoon Featured By Owner May 20, 2013  Student General Artist
If that's the case then: FAQ #155: How do I report a deviation which I think breaks the rules?

please note the mere depiction of genitals does not immediately conform to the definition of pornography that we have in place. If you have differing views on what you consider pornography that's all well and good, but if that's the case then this is a whole different conversation.

As for your deviation, I have another handy dandy FAQ for you! FAQ #305: Is posting 'Adult' oriented artwork alright if I censor it first?
Reply
:iconstinkehund:
Stinkehund Featured By Owner May 20, 2013  Hobbyist Digital Artist
And also, it's not even about my personal definition of pornography - but just putting "penis" or something along those lines in the searchbox shows me very clearly that there is a double-standard somewhere at play here. There are dicks everywhere! Cut, uncut, hairy, shaved, flaccid, erect - and i don't mind (no seriously, some of them look reeeaaally nice), but if those count as "art", why does other (way less, if at all, explicit) stuff get deleted? How is an implied sex-toy worse than an actual sex organ in full view?
It just makes no sense to me. And i would venture i'm not the only one who thinks like that.
Reply
:iconkozispoon:
kozispoon Featured By Owner May 20, 2013  Student General Artist
I'm uncertain as to how the opposite of a male organ is a sex toy. Wouldn't the opposite be a female sexual organ? If that is the case, then I would say there is a depiction of both in fair abundance and are both counted as art, respectively.

And I believe you misunderstand. This isn't a case of what's worse, but rather an article that was spurred on by the submission of work (i.e. ~FindChaos) which challenged the status quo- that quo being that sex toys of any kind were not allowed. If you give the article a read, I think you'd glean that we have not only welcome artistic exceptions to rule, but that we hope to continually grow and change while still maintaining a safe, artistic environment.
Reply
(1 Reply)
:iconstinkehund:
Stinkehund Featured By Owner May 20, 2013  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Yeah, that link would've been a better help before one of my pictures just got deleted. Just telling me that i should censor it would've been enough; wouldn't have lost the comments on it then...
Reply
:iconwickedjuti:
WickedJuti Featured By Owner Feb 15, 2013  Professional General Artist
Ahh alright. xD Thought so, but wanted to make sure if I get it right. ;P
Reply
:iconmilovanf:
milovanf Featured By Owner Jan 30, 2013  Professional Digital Artist
Let's just hope so that people on DA will respect these new rules that they are upload it now. DA isn't Facebook or Twitter where you can put everything what you've got on the idea. Especially erotic things that aren't aloud under 18 years old.
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:iconzero-shadowofthewolf:
OMG ......
ITS DORA THE EXPLORER D:
Reply
:iconkozispoon:
kozispoon Featured By Owner Jan 25, 2013  Student General Artist
Can you say receptive phallus?
...
Very good! :la:
Reply
:iconmori101:
Mori101 Featured By Owner Jan 23, 2013  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Honestly I find the name of the website being taken too literally. DeviantArt is NOT a porn website. However, sex toys shown not to be in usage are not porn.

This is not an excuse for dirty images meant SPECIFICALLY to turn on the viewer. Tasteful nudity is NOT porn. Sex toys not in use are NOT porn. Explicit sexual acts or sex toys in use IS porn and does not belong on the site.
Reply
:icongalickmaster:
galickmaster Featured By Owner Jan 23, 2013
DONT ADD PORN!
Reply
:iconnevegraceirvine2004:
NeveGraceIrvine2004 Featured By Owner Mar 6, 2013  Professional Digital Artist
A hacker who hacked :icontwisterthetornado: did.
Reply
:iconenterran-sago:
Enterran-Sago Featured By Owner Jan 18, 2013  Student General Artist
this is porn remove it [link]
Reply
:iconkozispoon:
kozispoon Featured By Owner Jan 18, 2013  Student General Artist
Hi there! :la:

My apologies, but a journal entry discussing a FAQ update is not the place to report deviations. Please use the Moderation system which can be accessed by clicking the 'Report Deviation' link found on every deviation page and those reports will be directed to the proper staff.

You can find more information on how and where to report deviations here: [link]

Hope that helps!
Reply
:iconilikecookies23:
ilikecookies23 Featured By Owner Dec 28, 2012  Student General Artist
GASSSSSSSPPPP :iconcannotevenplz:
Reply
:icondhverlander:
DHVerlander Featured By Owner Dec 11, 2012  Hobbyist Photographer
This is a can of worms really. Kind of like splitting a hair down the middle with a razor blade. I personally don't want censorship, but the people at DA have a tuff job trying to draw the line somewhere. I know I would if I had to do it. So much is in the eye of the beholder. I'm sure there were some ppl at DA that wanted some pornographic images allowed but decided against it as a whole I guess. After read some comments on here, I decided to look up a couple of definitions after reading Faq#565.

"Pornography (often abbreviated as "porn" in informal usage) is the explicit portrayal of sexual subject matter." -wikipedia

If I was to use this definition as a guideline, I'd say I've seen quite a lot of this on DA.

"Perversion is a concept describing those types of human behavior that deviate from that which is understood to be orthodox or normal." -wikipedia

....I've seen this on Da...

"Deviance, in a sociological context, describes actions or behaviors that violate social norms, including formally-enacted rules (e.g., crime),[1] as well as informal violations of social norms (e.g., rejecting folkways and mores)."- wikipedia

....and I've seen this on DA also...

Can a "pornographic" image be art? I think it depends, but I'm certainly not going to say no.
I think it can be done, but then again, it's in the eye of the beholder.

Even though I don't post any nudes or sexually/erotic material, I like to see other peoples work and appreciate it. And from someone such as I, who appreciates everything from fine nudes to fetish photography, I don't want to see DA slide down that slippery slope.

On the other hand.....

They only snag I have is the no erection, realistic, whatever you want to call it, rule. But only in educational settings or such. My wife was stunned. She's checks out DA when I'm not on and just doesn't understand how showing a woman's vag (you've seen the pics DA has allowed) can be art and somehow an erect penis isn't. I agree with her. I don't want to see full blown close up penetration porn on DA. (there are other websites for that if someone wants to see it) But somehow the image of an erect penis is taboo here, on DEVIANT ART? (unless it's educational of course) I think comes down to GENDER DISCRIMINATION.

vagina = art erect penis/phallus = porn. Great message.

DA has rules and has them for a reason. I get it. But rules are worthless unless enforced and not biased in it's approach. DA is letting a lot of female based images slide per rule 565 and hammering the men. I think the sex toy issue is a great example, because it's only women who have the majority of the sex toys that don't look like realistic phalluses or vaginas.
Reply
:iconcremecoco:
CremeCoco Featured By Owner Feb 6, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
honestly it depends on the person's meaning behind the picture or artform.
Reply
:iconchaoswolf1982:
chaoswolf1982 Featured By Owner Dec 27, 2012  Hobbyist General Artist
Unlike female genitals, which can have any context to their images, an erect penis is purely sexual.
Reply
:iconartthistle:
ArtThistle Featured By Owner Feb 23, 2013  Student Digital Artist
I'm just gonna put this out there... My boyfriend frequently gets an erection when he sneezes really hard. Does that mean he wants to have sex? No. It just kinda... Happens. An erect penis is, without a doubt, not a purely sexual image.
Reply
:iconchaoswolf1982:
chaoswolf1982 Featured By Owner Feb 23, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
The urge is not the point. The physiology is. Male erection (and female lubrication) are purely sexual reactions. They serve no other purpose. Thus why they are blacklisted from DA's acceptable-content listing.
Reply
:iconbungy32:
Bungy32 Featured By Owner Mar 10, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
Um, no. That is not true. "Morning wood" being one example. "Pee hard" being another. Erections result from internal chemical (hormonal, primarily) triggers -- usually the result of sexual arousal, but not always.
deviantART muro drawing Comment Drawing
Reply
:iconchaoswolf1982:
chaoswolf1982 Featured By Owner Mar 10, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
When I said the term "sexual reactions", I meant an erection is sexual in nature and purpose, not that its only origin was arousal. Unlike, say, the breasts, an erect penis has no function beyond sexuality.
Reply
:iconpurplechaos:
PurpleChaos Featured By Owner Mar 3, 2013
Whihc raises the question of whether said standards are too restrictive.
Reply
:iconchaoswolf1982:
chaoswolf1982 Featured By Owner Mar 3, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
They are not too restrictive. This is not a porn site. What benefit would there be in including such things as those?
Reply
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